29 Comments

  1. beelbeebub

    It might be worth mentioning that Prof Dalgliesh admitted that the issues he experienced with cancer research were due to the UK government’s implementation of the EU directive rather than the EU directive itself.

    • Pip

      Can anyone tell me what the total costs and timeframe will be to cover the actual act of removing us from the EU? And whether those costs will come out of the £13Bn or borne by the man in the street?

      Take simple things like Passports and car registration plates. Yes, I know, silly things but will the US let us past Border control with a technically invalid Passport? What about driving to France with an illegal license plate? At some point (how long?) we will all have to make the change.

      What happens to all the EU citizens working in the UK? Will they be asked to leave (leaving us with a huge income tax revenue hole or be allowed to stay while applying for a work visa? And who will bear the cost of administering that system?

      Once you start unpicking us from the EU the lists of unknowns and costs starts getting frightening!

  2. Keith

    I suggest that you united states of Europe supporters check your facts We do pay our imperial masters and overlords £350 million a week.
    Yes they do lower themselves to give some of it back,but they then order us serfs how we may spend it.
    Freedom day is coming and your gravy train is going to end.
    Bring it on.

    • Rob Davidson

      Hi Keith. The total contribution could be seen as £350 million except that we get our rebate and we get a wad of cash back from various EU progammes. The rebate is subtracted prior to us making any payments so we never, ever pay £350 million to the EU. Never.
      The net payment to the EU works out to be about £160 million per week.

    • Andy

      How much is that a day?
      £12.9 billion is around £35 million a day. That’s less than the £55 million-a-day figure that a lot of people campaigning the leave the EU cite.
      That’s because the £55 million figure is based on the EU contribution before the rebate is applied. Brexit campaigners use the phrase “£55 million is sent to the EU every day” to suggest that the gross sum is paid to Brussels before a portion is sent back to the UK.
      In fact, the rebate is effectively deducted at source, and so not actually sent to the EU at all.

  3. Paul

    Look.. its this simple.. for anyone saying ”I dont agree with it as it is but we wlll change it from inside”.. lets dispel that right away… we threatened them that we would have a referendum and LEAVE.. They refused POINT BLANK to change anything.. even with the biggest threat we had at our disposal to hit them with………….. so what makes you think they will change a single thing if we are stuck in forever with nothing to hit back with?You vote to stay in.. you vote to stay in totally unarmed and at the goodwill and mercy of 30 nations (most of whom we’ve been to war with many many times) whose priorities are NOT YOU. And who never have to answer to you.. and to whom you can never do anything. I pinched this of some1 else but pretty much sums how I feel

    • Luke

      Your argument seems to be built on the idea that the only way to get people to enact change is to do something to threaten them. Having been in situations where people have tried that I can confidently say that the best way to enact change is not to threaten people as you only end up alienating them and turning them against you. Instead progress comes from compromise, swallowing ones pride and looking at things from other peoples point of view. Most other European nations seem to know this and those that don’t are learning, apparently faster than the UK though.

    • alex

      interesting view… it sounds like the UK does not have 9.7% of MEPs or if every policy you want would be achievable by being outside the EU since – of course – the majority of UK MPs agree with you every time. It’s called political negotiation. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, usually you compromise.

    • Jo

      “They”? Given that the UK has 73 MEPs of a total of 751, for 30 countries, I would argue “we” actually have fair representation.

  4. Tim

    Rob Davidson. Typo here…. “You may also notice in the bus photo that the Leave campaign are still touting that we pay £350 million per day”

  5. Chris M

    The rebate isn’t an entitlement, it will be taken off us eventually, the Germans don’t like it. The portion of money we “get back” from the EU isn’t for anything like the NHS, it’s for odd projects that are EU approved.

  6. Turrican

    Any supporters of the NHS ought to read about TTIP and think twice about voting to remain. The EU will force the privatisation of the NHS. Most EU countries DO NOT have national health services, but are based on an insurance system. ‘Healthier In’ is either woefully misinformed about the EU’s benefits, or deliberately misleading its readers. If you support a federal united states of Europe, just come out and say it instead of trying to pull the wool over the public’s eyes

      • Turrican

        I’m afraid that link is rather biased itself and is not discussing TTIP itself but rather an Express article regarding TTIP. The Express is obviously well known as a right-wing sensationalist newspaper and therefore will ham up anything it gets its hands on. However, my point is this: the left in the UK cannot understand what the EU really is- it is an asset stripping neoliberal organisation. TTIP is only good for business and cannot coexist with nationalised industries (including health) of ANY kind. The EU is facilitating this- they forced the Irish to pay for their water recently. If you think health will be ‘ring-fenced’ you’re very much mistaken.

          • Turrican

            It just boils down to whether you trust the ‘publicly stated negotiating position’ or not. You obviously do, I don’t, so we’ll have to agree to disagree. Germany, France, Italy DO NOT have anything remotely as comprehensive as the NHS. I know, because I have lived in these countries. If you believe the 27 other member states will go out of their way to protect the very special case of the NHS, you’re going to be very disappointed. But fair enough, you have your opinion and I have mine. In a way the argument boils down to the core problem in the UK’s relationship with the EU: Our ‘benefits’ system is so different to the rest of Europe that harmonisation is almost impossible, creating a massive imbalance when it comes to public sector spending and migration to the UK.

          • Rob Davidson

            If we look at the actual data for how healthcare is financed, we can see that many EU members have similar percentages of public vs private spending to the UK and that some countries like the Netherlands actually covers more of its health care through public sources than the UK does (see figure 1 – http://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/docserver/download/8112121ec056.pdf?expires=1463404105&id=id&accname=guest&checksum=8AB333151875480A885E128E5212212B )

            Looking at another depiction of the same sort of analysis, we can see that EU members are much closer to the UK system than they are to the US system (see figure 2 – https://www.oecd.org/health/health-systems/Focus-Health-Spending-2015.pdf)

            There is no reason to believe that all EU members will choose to accept a transition to an American-style system.
            There is also no reason to doubt the ‘publicly stated negotiating position’. There is every reason to remain vigilant, to scrutinise ongoing negotiations and to hold our MEPs to keeping to the ‘publicly stated negotiating position’, but there is no reason to simply say that the EU can’t be trusted.

  7. Peter archer

    Like it or lump it the Euro is a massive drain on our economy . We havnt got enough money to bale out the problems of Europe . great Britain earned its reputation , put a penny in their tin but don’t sell the crown jewels. please don’t give away what is not yours to give .we are merely the current custodians of our Great Britain we don’t have the right to give what our descendants died for away . We have a duty to pass this on to future generations . Brexit is the only way forward .

  8. You all seem to forget the principle of what the out want and its OUR COUNTRY BACK its not about money . We want our soverignty back where we make OUR own laws not dictated by people in Brussels who are not elected. And we have no say in what is debated OUT OUT OUT

  9. People are being mislead by lies by the Government who are the most to prosper from a corrupt EU
    We the ordinary working class will suffer big time

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